FANDOM


  • Servant of Evillious
    Servant of Evillious closed this thread because:
    Post count. A newer thread has been made: http://theevilliouschronicles.wikia.com/wiki/Thread:32933
    23:19, November 27, 2014

    This thread will be used for fans to discuss The Daughter of Evil light novel series, including information, translations, and chronology. As a reminder, please be respectful in your replies and keep them relevant to the discussion. While this may be a little late to say, feel free to express your excitement over any announced releases here as well.

      Loading editor
    • o:

        Loading editor
    • Ok, then, what do we have so far? Any new information?

        Loading editor
    • Well we got that solid confirmation from the back of Praefatio that Riliane was supposed to be Gretel before Ney screwed up fate. So technically that's new but I've heard hearsay of it for a while now.

        Loading editor
    • Oh, nice. Then it's now canon that Ney's birth botched up the original plans. Anything else? Hold nothing back.

        Loading editor
    • yeah, don't want anything being Held back :3

        Loading editor
    • Alexiel Lucifen wrote: yeah, don't want anything being Held back :3

      Pfft. What you did there. I see it.

        Loading editor
    • Alexiel Lucifen wrote:
      yeah, don't want anything being Held back :3


      I would've like that to have been held back for like... forever... XD

        Loading editor
    • lol, I liked it

        Loading editor
    • I would like to ask if any more information has been released recently concerning the Clockwork Magic mentioned in Wiegenlied, since Praeludium is in stages of translation (this can apply to anyone who is working on translations <.<; )

        Loading editor
    • Octofan wrote:
      I would like to ask if any more information has been released recently concerning the Clockwork Magic mentioned in Wiegenlied, since Praeludium is in stages of translation (this can apply to anyone who is working on translations <.<; )


      I've seen Japanese sources point out the same inconsistency between what Act 2 portrays and Held's statements so it's definitely not a translation error.

      I also have seen this being pointed at as the particular spell for exorcising the demons: クロックワークの秘術 (Clockwork Secret Arts?).

        Loading editor
    • think the Clockwork Lullaby effect the Demons and/or the Sins?

        Loading editor
    • I don't think so. It seems to just be used to track magic such as the vessels of sin. Then again, it does seem to get "changed" when being used for Irregular so maybe.

      Which reminds me... I think Julia learned how to make Gift from Prim, since it's from her family's area and was used so often by her (and once by Presi). They spent a few decades together so I think that's more than enough time for Abyss I.R. to ask about how to make it. XD

        Loading editor
    • I don't think the lullaby would be changed to effect the demons/ sins either, since MotC seems to have sung it to Irregular herself. If it did have an effect on them, it probably would've done something to those at who heard her at the theater.

      I agree, it seems pointless for her to go through the efforts of actually finding that recipe when she spent so much time with people who already knew it.

        Loading editor
    • like make the less like their Sin? all but Vanica who is still like here Sin and was out side so she might not have heard the song

        Loading editor
    • Maybe but wouldn't MotG hear it since even people outside the forest could hear it?

        Loading editor
    • idk, the song is weird

        Loading editor
    • Noted. Back on topic, I think it's fair to bring up Abyss I.R. and her miraculous survival. We've established that Seth put Irina in the cat body and that she somehow got the ability to have the cat manipulate bodies as if they were her own. Germaine finds this out and gloriously skewers our villain on her sword. The cat's dead, Mikina's freed, the sorceress is believed to be dead, and everyone lives a lukewarm forever after... until three years down the line Abyss I.R. attacks Germaine, defeats her, and uses her body up through EC 611.... So I guess the big question is how exactly did she survive when Praefatio's climax demonstrates getting skewered by Germaine was not a "meh" for her.

        Loading editor
    • I think it is part of Abyss's powers, not linked to a host, Adam cut that link with Elluka

        Loading editor
    • Since the cat wasn't actually alive to begin with I'm more confused about why stabbing it would make a difference at all. Maybe Irina's soul was disrupted by Germaine's sword and that's why she stopped interfering for 3 years, but those three years were enough to get her strength back?

        Loading editor
    • either way Abyss needs a host, living or not. the known hosts(head canon) are Elluka(Mayu), Irina, Eve, the cat, Germaine and Elluka(MA)

        Loading editor
    • It definitely seems like an odd gap. Then again, Irina and Elluka seem to be masters of procrastination (tests a sword in EC 477 to make sure it works; waits several years before meeting with Prim so she could use it).

      I thought that perhaps she might've been playing dead but that kind of falls flat when you spend an entire fight not getting stabbed in the first place.. Unless it somehow has something to do with her experiments on Ney and her creation of the Espionage Task Force.

        Loading editor
    • Irina's not a host, she's the girl's actual body :P (I'm not going into a theory that causes only more questions.) And whatever happened to her via Seth, it could have made her able to move her soul from place to place similar to the Demons of Sin as opposed to dying right away when outside a vessel.

      I'm just saying that if the cat gets stabbed by a physical weapon, it's not going to make a difference since the cat is stuffed--it is not going to die. If Irina's soul is not physical then I would think she could walk around with the cat having a gaping hole in it, since she apparently didn't need organs to function. Unless the cat actually split in two, but Germaine's sword isn't that thick...

      I think maybe she left the cat then and fixated on a much less useful vessel until she could gather the strength to invade someone else/Germaine. (I'm less clear here--did she possess Germaine out of the blue or did she come to her with another unknown host...?)

        Loading editor
    • I don't think she used another host, I think it was direct and if you are right about the not needing a living host, think Germaine died way before she was done using it?

        Loading editor
    • The Fanbook wasn't specific. It just says: "After the stuffed cat that was her main body was destroyed on the beach, she was thought ot be dead, but she later appeared in the New Four Hosemen Incident. She took over the body of Germaine, and after a hundread years, she established the criminal organization Pere Noel as Julia Abelard."

      Pretty vague statement. Could be the cat again, could be her as a spirit. Could be her in another body. Germaine's is slightly less vague... at least it establishes the two had fought again after being "reunited" but she apparently was defeated because of her neck injury from three years earlier...

        Loading editor
    • Theory tyme (be happy Servy-san. XP)! Personally, I like to think that she at least requires a physical appearance to exist. In my mind, she took over Germaine because the swordswoman was the last one to make contact with her- though indirectly through a sword. After that, I figured that she resided in her body similarly to when Elluka temporarily co-resided with Gumillia. Perhaps she needed some time to take action and take over the new body again, or even to just get used to be and such more direct control of a human.

      There~ now prove me wrong and point out my flaws. <3 BecauseI'mtoolazytodothatmyself,andsecondopinionshonestlyhelp.

        Loading editor
    • yeah, how long has it been since she has been in a human body?

        Loading editor
    • Being the horrible mathematician I am- I'm just going to say it's been 500 years give or take. XD

      Then again, we're had forest spirits like Michaela and Gumillia suddenly turn human. They may not have acted like they knew what they were doing, but they seemed to get the physical aspects down pretty easily. Real-world logic isn't the most reliable in anything but the real world it would seem. OoO

        Loading editor
    • UnitedStateofPikachulious wrote:
      Being the horrible mathematician I am- I'm just going to say it's been 500 years give or take. XD

      Then again, we're had forest spirits like Michaela and Gumillia suddenly turn human. They may not have acted like they knew what they were doing, but they seemed to get the physical aspects down pretty easily. Real-world logic isn't the most reliable in anything but the real world it would seem. OoO

      To be fair, Elluka was teaching Gumillia and Michaela all about being human for 3 months. mothy at least gave time so the characters could somewhat believably learn how humans do things before the main story takes place (although I don't think it's that strong an explanation, regardless).

      I think your theory makes sense, except I think Germaine was chosen because Abyss I.R. wanted her heal factor. It's interesting how Germaine is the one who reencounter Abyss I.R. when the sorceress had pointed out Germaine's unique ability aloud (apparently) and is known for collecting bodies. Then again, if Abyss I.R. actually fought Germaine before taking her body in EC 508, would that punch holes in your theory?

        Loading editor
    • .*snaps fingers* Oh yeah, I forgot about that New Four Hoursemen Incident. I haven't read into/ memorized that one yet. '>>

      (This is why Pika doesn't make theories, she always overlooks something and/ or forgets a simplistic yet theory ruining detail~. ShecouldneverbeMothy. XD)

        Loading editor
    • That's alright. The best theory I can come up with is that Seth was attempting to create a (or something akin to a) vessel of sin and Irina was made the demon while the cat was made the vessel (albeit a mobile vessel). Not a lot of evidence to support it though. Best explanation I can think of to explain why only those possessed (or used as the vessel of) a Demon of Sin can understand I.R. as the cat and how Abyss survived after her "body" was clearly destroyed. Maybe Irina couldn't be killed by just destroying her vessel and found a new vessel? If the demons were able to find vessels of their own, they have to have some degree of mobility, even if they are stuck in them (or refuse to leave) afterward.

        Loading editor
    • There are a few names I'd like to bring up for the discussion.

      To get the minor one out of the way, I think we should change the pure romanization of "Zasuko". I found nothing on his brother Yarera, but I found that his Japanese name (ザスコ) is used for several companies, spelling it as "Zusco" so I think that or "Zasco/Zasko" could be it.

      Then there is Koopa, who I have heard several people suggest maybe "Cooper". At least when I check, Cooper is spelled as クーパー while we have ours as コーパ. So if it is Cooper, I don't think it's a common spelling.

      Then there's Liliane Mouchet. I think this is a given, but her name should be "Riliane Mouchet" imo. Praeludium's dialogue sounds a bit off when you translate it as "Liliane", especially when the katakana are the same as Princess Riliane's and she's supposed to be named after "Riliane Roses", like Princess Riliane.

      Finally, bringing up the Rollam/Lolam/Luo Lamu. After a user brought it up a little while back, I looked into it and can confirm that  the Lolam bird and Rollam city share the same Japanese name (ローラム). Similarly, I think the scene makes even more sense when you replace "luo lamu" with "Rollam".

      Similarly, I think that "Lola Munao" in Cloture is just a poor translation of "lolam bird fathers", especially since Wiegenlied brings up that the bird feathers are used to make the pens Yukina likes, which is what Keel says in Cloture is why he gets them.

        Loading editor
    • Okay, I'm just going to give a few inputs of my own then >u>;

      For the names, I would be fine with either Zasco or Zasko, however I'm leaning a bit more on the Zasko side of it. As for our dear friend Koopa, it could be in fact Cooper and I'm fine with that as well. It could be just an uncommon spelling, we would have never suspected Eldoh to be Held going by the spelling as well XD

      I'm not really sure about how I feel about the Liliane to Riliane, I think it could be just Riliane as well, the katakana are the same and the point you brought up about how she's she's supposed to be named after Riliane Roses....maybe it's just the way it's pronounced that we see it that way because of a little language we like to call Engrish :p But I'm not to sure about that change once again but if it's changed to Riliane I'm fine with it >~<;

        Loading editor
    • I must say that I agree with all the changes that were brought up. Although I'm not particularly leaning towards either side of Zasco/ Zasko, I can still see the meaning behind changing them. I'm also on board for Koopa's transition to Cooper, as I've been leaning towards that change for a while now myself. Likewise, I hold no disagreements to Liliane becoming Riliane, as it has generally felt awkwark to read certain sentences that imply they have imply they have the same name, and see "Liliane" instead.

      As for the bird's name and the location, I could easily envision one being named after the other. I wouldn't be surprised it this all came from a fascination with that one bird's species either, so I'm perfectly fine with that as well.

        Loading editor
    • On the other hand, would we still have her nickname as Lily or change it to the horribly Engrish Rily?

      I mean if there's no official spelling available (weren'thoseintheFanbookor--) then there's two things to consider--one is that it's a pun on her Vocaloid's name, and the other is that it's the same name as Riliane. Personally, I think it's more important to follow the story's cues, so I'm for the change, but I'm less sure about her nickname.

      I also throw in my lot with Zasko ;~; Goodbye Zasuko you were my favorite name.

      I'm not sure about Cooper if it's an uncommon spelling, though. I think maybe we should keep it the way it is, for now? ^ ^; (Although we have Held and Chirclatia, so...) 

      Aaaand I agree with everything about the Lola/Lou/Rollam/whatever debate. ouo;

        Loading editor
    • Personally, I don't think we should change her nickname to "Rily", I think that would be pretty horrible name change or nickname in this case. If you do follow the story's cues....when someone is usually named after someone, it's almost always the same name and then there's the spelling that matches up perfectly. I would be content as well as having her name changed as well but really dat Engrish- it kind of has us a bit screwed over in this sense :p

      I forgot to mention this but I also agree with the Lola/Lou/Rollam/whatever debate as Octo likes to call it. XD

        Loading editor
    • I don't think we need to change the nickname. Princess Riliane's name is confirmed in the Fanbook as "Riliane", so logically both her great-grandmother and Lily should have that as their name spelling too. Her nickname "Lily" is an out-of-universe reference to her Vocaloid and an in-universe pun for "Riliane" to the average Japanese speaker (Ririannu --> Ririi). There isn't the R-L sound similarity in Japanese so it may not make perfect sense to us, but makes sense in the context of the intended audience.

      That's how I look at it anyway.

      I'm for Zusco, personally, just going by the company translations of the name. Same with Rollam/Lolam. Only decision now is what spelling we will choose for it. I'd also like Koopa to stay the same for now.

        Loading editor
    • <.< You mean Zasco right?

        Loading editor
    • I know what I said. :P Check my above post. I had linked the example picture for how the Japanese was translated as "Zusco" for some company logos. The romaji is "Zasuko" So I can see how that could be "Zusco", although we could be flexible and say Zasco/Zasko too.

        Loading editor
    • Ohhh, sorry ^ ^;; I will read for comprehension next time. I guess Zusco could be it too <.<

        Loading editor
    • Oh. Um. Where have I been?

      Welp. Liliane to Riliane makes sense; it also goes with her insisting to just be called "Lily". I mean...how I see it anyhow. As for Zasuko, Zusco or Zasco works fine. But I'm not exactly sold on 'Cooper'. I mean if it matches, works and makes sense and whatnot, sure.
      I'm not really catching on to the "Lola/Lou/Rollam/whatever debate" so I just wouldn't know what I'm talking about there.
      ( OuO)
      (OuO )

      Looks like that's all I have.

        Loading editor
    • Alright, looks like Rollam and Riliane has clear consensus. What's everyone's thoughts on how we spell it?

      Lolam? Rollam? I understand a lot of people draw comparisons between Rolled and the Rolled Roller for Rin and Len. Perhaps this is also part of that pun (Like the Banica and Muzuri cannibalism thing I brought up earlier)? The only difference between Rollam and "Roller" is their last character (Roller= ローラー; Rollam= ローラム).

        Loading editor
    • If that's the case then I'd definitely want to go with Rollam as my vote~.

        Loading editor
    • Rollam is to my preference as well. :3

        Loading editor
    • Rollam is okay, but there is still the Lolam bird being called that, so I don't know...the city could be named after the bird. 8I

        Loading editor
    • Or the bird could be named after the city; chicken or the age scenario. I think I'll throw my hat in with Rollam and the rollam bird, personally.

        Loading editor
    • 8O Oh it's not a real bird?

      Pffft Rollam is okay with me then XD

        Loading editor
    • Alright, I think that's enough time for consensus. Rollam it is then. We'll make the appropriate changes to all affected articles.

      Next topic: Allen's execution. CoY tells us Germaine, Keel, and Chartette were all present but what about Riliane? The light novel remains silent on that.

      In the original song PV, we see a crying Riliane garbed in a cloak in the corner towards the end, after Len and Rin both sing about the impending execution. Based on that, I'd like to think Riliane was there, hence why it took some time between when the execution took place and when Clarith found her at the port town.

        Loading editor
    • Well isn't it obvious? I doubt they could mention she was there as it's from Allen's point of view and he wouldn't give the crowd the time of day

        Loading editor
    • Thinking about it, I don't believe that Mothy would change his mind about whether it was there or not. Seeing as she continually watched the execution from the Original PV's to the Velvet versions, I'd say that I approve to the idea of including it.

        Loading editor
    • I would also add on that she collasped from hunger and was visibly malnourished, which would not have just been a result of being lost in the forest for a while (I mean she probably wouldn't have gotten that lost; she made her way to the coastline from the palace fairly easily in the first chapter.) I'm in favor of anything extending the time she spent from her escape to being found, weak and hungry, by Clarith. Waiting a day or so until seeing Allen's execution, and then trying to reach the coast from Lucifenian, could provide enough time. (Unless I'm missing something here.) Not to mention that nothing contradicts it, while we have one image supporting it. 

        Loading editor
    • Sounds reasonable. With the manga version around the corner (depending on how many volumes it takes), we may see that scene thrown in there too.

        Loading editor
    • Adding on with what Octo said and Riliane /plausibly/ seeing the execution, it would make sense that she could have gotten lost, being most likely distraught with grief and regret at the loss of Allen. Also I agree with the idea that Riliane was at the excecution, for example the Project Mirai video shows her after the execution ( I will also note that even as rather accurate the videos are, they did show Clarith watching Micheala sing...).

        Loading editor
    • wait, I heard rumor that Germaine knew Alexiel took Rilianne place, that true?

        Loading editor
    • Yeah, it was pretty explicit in CoY that Germaine was fully aware who she had ended up putting on the chopping block.

        Loading editor
    • A rumor? It's true- It's in the The Daughter of Evil: Clôture of Yellow, when Germaine comes to visit "Riliane" in the palace's dungeon, she realizes it's in fact Allen and asks him why he'd do such a thing and then Allen reveals her past to Germaine and the fact that him and Rillane were twins.   

        Loading editor
    • at the end of the SoE she gave her the watch to remember Alexiel by. Kyle was there too

        Loading editor
    • I think you are referring to a fanmade PV, I've seen that one too. Nothing like that comes up in the original or even the velet mix. :O Even though the velvet mix has more than a few inconsistences of their own XD

        Loading editor
    • oh

        Loading editor
    • I have a question--since on the Waltz discussion we've got Arth's concept art available, and there's already a fanblog making use of it for an avatar, would we start constructing an Arth page with the concept art as well, probably to change it to a more appropriate picture when we get scans of the manga, or would we wait a little longer to relieve the Minor Character List of that section? In the case of the former (which is probably more likely because it's concept art,) would we at least add his image into the Minor Character's section?

        Loading editor
    • Of course we would make our post around the same time. XD I'm fine with him having his own article now.

        Loading editor
    • same, I want an Arth page

        Loading editor
    • Yeah, there should be an attempt at an Arth page atleast. Anne already has a page (although there was also a good amount of info for her) and it's always bugged me how Riliane and Alexiel's father didn't. I'm also wondering if Arth was a blonde; Don't most of the Lucifinian royal family articles metion the Royal family being known for pale skin, blue eyes and blonde hair? It'll be strange for me if Arth has dark hair and his wife fits more with the description, considering she married into the family.

        Loading editor
    • Alright, I started a basic layout for a page. On another note, the website is up and we have some sample images. Although no one's mentioned it, I'm leaving this potential new Riliane avatar in case anyone feels it would be better and/or would like it changed:


      Rilianeavatar

      Done in 2x3 proportions already

      We'll also be getting a trailer soon. That should be neat.

      Purchasing the manga from the Animate Online Shop yields an album too:

      "The Daughter of Evil BGM Collection for Reading"

      『「悪ノ娘」 読書のためのBGM集』

      Included with it is The Daughter and Servant of Evil from the Four Meldoies of Evil album, and both The Daughter of Evil and The Servant of Evil "arranged versions" by  トラボルタ.

      Book marks also come with the original purchase and their's a lottery going around for buying the manga.

        Loading editor
    • I like the new possible Riliane avi, I'd say yes~.

        Loading editor
    • Hey guys, it seems we're gettin ANOTHER depiction of The Lucifenian Royal Palace. I found this on the site (It's a little blurry... sorry ). I'm not sure what it's for but I think it might be album cover for the background music for reading.
      Royal palace
        Loading editor
    • Yeah it's the cover, that was added to the album a little while ago. The Lucifenian Royal Palace also had it's most recent depiction added to the gallery. Ichika confirmed on tumblr she used Versailles as the base.

        Loading editor
    • Ah Alright, thanks Servy! I wasn't sure if anyone had noticed... Ugh I wish I could read Japanese, I really want to buy the manga. I for one am excited by the fact that the Palace is Versailles..since I'm a bit of a Marie Antoinette buff.

        Loading editor
    • Mothy loves making people draw Versailles-esque buildings, doesn't he? :U Not that I mind, the real-life building itself looks great for it's age (if memory serves- it's decently old).

      I'm all for an avi change, that one looks like it may fit the infobox better, and I generally love the art style for it more. Ichika has improved~.

        Loading editor
    • Just to make sure everyone knows, you can buy this manga and have it shipped to you rather easily through Amazon.jp. At the top of the main page, you should see a bar at the end that says "In English". Click that and the whole interface becomes English for you. From there, just copy/past the Japanese name of the book/manga you want, register an account (if you desire), and then go through the normal online proceedings. It's as easy as regular Amazon and the only added cost is shipping and handling (keep in mind, not all products ship to the Western hemisphere). 

      I like the Versailles too but I don't think mothy dictates that. Otherwise, Ichika wouldn't have used a generic castle for the CoY illustration.

      Alright, the new avatar is posted.

      Edit: Japanese name for Act 1 COMIC『悪ノ娘 第一幕』

        Loading editor
    • Haha I think he does. As for the avi change, it is really good. I like it. Also I remember that Ichika told me s/he uses 'After effects' for videos.

        Loading editor
    • Oh interesting- I myself have never used Amazon but I'll probably check it out. Thanks for the tips~.

      True... So Ichika really likes Versailles then. /shot "After effects"? I'm quite sure I know what she would mean by that, but I guess that's why some videos can take so long... Aside from the fact that art generally takes awhile to make. :U

      The new avatar does indeed look so much better, in my opinion as well.

        Loading editor
    • The avatar.....I like it.....but....
      I don't remember what it was before this.

        Loading editor
    • WELL Resi.

      http://theevilliouschronicles.wikia.com/wiki/Riliane_Lucifen_d%27Autriche?diff=prev&oldid=56754

      Simple solutions.

      This is why you should be careful with what you put on the internet kiddies, even if it looks like someone replaced it or took it down... they can always hack. Although this wasn't hacking Pika-

        Loading editor
    • For Riliane's avatar,I think we should keep the EK one, because it shows Rin. ^-^

        Loading editor
    • That was as much hacking as sneaking onto someone's computer while they're away and saying you hacked their account when they were already logged in. But anyway....
      Mhmm. It's lovely.

        Loading editor
    • The page for Arth the first looks really good. I can't wait for Ichika to create a picture of Arth that isn't a concept though..

        Loading editor
    • It's worth bringing up that Ichika answered on tumblr that Arth's design is based on an adult Len. Not sure if that equates to being represented by but definitely worth a trivia, at least.

        Loading editor
    • so Arth might also be represent by Len?

        Loading editor
    • If we do say that Arth is represented by Len, I have no objections but if we don't then I say we should add it as a trivia point, perhaps something we can add to the trivia including how Arth and Alexiel wear the same ponytails, we can reword it to something like this:

      • Like his son, Alexiel, Arth tied his hair in a ponytail and his design is based on an adult Len Kagamine, the same Vocaloid representative as Alexiel.


      We can reword this too but it's just a suggestion, like I said I'm fine if we say that Len represents Arth thing too, I'm neutral to both.

        Loading editor
    • I don't know if I'm for saying he was actually represented by Len.
      I mean maybe.
      But.
      He was more inspired than represented in this mind.
      If saying represented is chosen though, that works too. ⊙‿⊙

        Loading editor
    • Generally, even if characters are way older or younger than they appear, they always have the general appearance of their represented Vocaloid/Utau/whatever (I think the only difference between typical Len and Len mothy characters is the lack of spiky hair for a canon design). Considering that, I'm leaning slightly more on trivia since Arth's design was specifically made with an adult look in mind, rather than just a Len look.

        Loading editor
    • at the same time, I wonder if he can be Yohio?

        Loading editor
    • I'm not overly surprised that there's more than one character based off Len in Pride's series. There has been at least 3 speculated Rin characters, being Riliane, Yvette and Sarah. 

        Loading editor
    • O.O

        Loading editor
    • I'm indifferent towards it, but, just to comfirm what Servy said about age difference (between character and Vocalod/utau), Sweet ANN is 23. And Annlee Sweets is 59.

        Loading editor
    • Wait, does Sweet ANN actually have an age? Either way, Arth being an older Len doesn't matter to me. I've seen so many Yamashizuku videos with Suzunosuke drawing older looking Lens that it doesn't bother me or what not.

        Loading editor
    • I would laugh so hard if mothy ever released a song with Len singing as Arth. Possibly the most ambitious and successful king in Lucifenia's history and he sounds like a pre-pubescent teen. XD

      Bringing up DoE: Act 1, So far all the scenes I think we've seen in previews are from Chapter 1 of CoY (including flashbacks). I think this volume will end with Leonhart's funeral to help pull new fans into the next and they'll release by each light novel chapter, save for Chapters 4 and 5, where I think they'll be put together.

        Loading editor
    • Agreed Servy, the like one/two pages I've seen are when Allen and Chartette are cleaning the fountain at the start of the chapter when the castle is preparing for Riliane's 14th birthday.


      I also agree with if Arth ever got a song it would be mighty strange.

        Loading editor
    • I think that there would be atleast 2-3 manga for each novel, maybe on next the cover we'll have Allen.

        Loading editor
    • I'd like that. If we get 3 for each light novel, that would be 12 total, barring the manga going further into the side stories or the New Four Horsemen Incident.

      Riliane, Allen, Germaine, Rin, Michaela, Clarith, Kyle, and Yukina are probably guaranteed to pop up at some point on the covers. Ney, Chartette, Gumillia, and Elluka have a pretty good chance too. I guess we'll see when more volumes come out.

        Loading editor
    • Servant of Evillious wrote: I would laugh so hard if mothy ever released a song with Len singing as Arth. Possibly the most ambitious and successful king in Lucifenia's history and he sounds like a pre-pubescent teen. XD

      Bringing up DoE: Act 1, So far all the scenes I think we've seen in previews are from Chapter 1 of CoY (including flashbacks). I think this volume will end with Leonhart's funeral to help pull new fans into the next and they'll release by each light novel chapter, save for Chapters 4 and 5, where I think they'll be put together.

      that would be funny, in that case I hope Arth is Yohio

        Loading editor
    • I would hope in that case that Mothy would use Yohio as well, and not because I actually am a major fan of Yohioloid's voice provider and having mothy make a Yohioloid song would complete my life..

        Loading editor
    • I think I'm pretty satisfied without a song from him at all. OvO;
      If anyone, I'd really want Germaine to have one.
      But I don't know...I think he should keep to his kingdom and stay off the stage.

      Just some non-serious thoughts.

        Loading editor
    • I think Germaine getting a song is possible, if it ends with her being defeated and taken by Abyss I.R. That way, it can tie into the new Summer releases with Margarita and Lemy.

      I'd like it to help fans bridge the other songs to Handbeat; I always see questions about what that song has to do with the others and for good reason. A song about her depression after the revolution and new motivation up through her possession would be nice (and MEIKO V3 would give mothy the incentive).

        Loading editor
    • I agree, Germaine definately needs a song. Everyone else has a song (Michela, Clarith, Kyle, Riliane,Allen....even Josephine /although it remains unpublished/). But would Mothy actually buy MEIKO V3? I'm not sure if he ever bought the Kagamine Appends as it is. As for Arth getting a song, why bother? He's already been dead for at least seven years by the time Riliane takes over the throne...

        Loading editor
    • I always thought that there would be a song one day dedicated to the prominent dead and minor characters in Evillious and they would all be sung by UTAUloids OUO

      I don't know about a Germaine song, specifically. Maybe a song dedicated to I. Santa, which touches upon how she was possessed and bit of Germaine's past life? (There could be a song for each Pere Noel member except II. Blue ) Not much different from your opinion, SoE, it's really all about the central focus on the song <.<

        Loading editor
    • Mothy has Rin Len Append and Miku Append.  Len Append (power) was used in Pierrot, Miku Append in Flower of the Plateau (solid), Survival Ma (Solid and maybe Soft) and Moonlit Bear New Version (solid)

        Loading editor
    • A mothy song with Yohioloid... EEP

        Loading editor
    • Ah Thanks Danytaly. I knew about Mothy having Miku Append since it's very easy to distinguish solid from vanilla but I wasn't sure about the Kagamine Appends. Also I see what you did there Octo, about ll. Blue never getting a song.

        Loading editor
    • DaughteroftheforestCourt1 wrote:
      I agree, Germaine definately needs a song. Everyone else has a song (Michela, Clarith, Kyle, Riliane,Allen....even Josephine /although it remains unpublished/).

      Based on the phrasing in the Japanese, it sounds like it was just a story idea in his head and got scrapped really early on; either way, it's true that all the other principal characters have had a singing role (although Yukina's is really small).

      With the way mothy's schedule is, barring albums, it seems he'll post mayb 2-3 songs at most this year (with PVs, of course). If he's going to be promoting the upcoming light novels, I can see a I. the Santa song with MEIKO V3 and possibly Iroha.

        Loading editor
    • Well, I hope Mothy can get MEIKO V3, because it sounds gorgeous (specially the Power vb), seems easy to tune and keeps the essence of the original MEIKO. BTW, do you think Mothy will attempt to get Miku V3 English?

        Loading editor
    • I think they come together

        Loading editor
    • For Miku V3, there is Miku V3 English, Miku V3 and the Miku V3 bundle pack which has Japanese and English. It would depend on what Mothy would get. As for Kaito/Meiko v3 I think they come all together...

        Loading editor
    • I have to agree; I hope he's able to obtain said voice bank as well. >u>

      But let's be real, he could use the worst voice possible and everyone would crowd around with notepads out.

        Loading editor
    • yeah, it is no longer about the quality of the song anymore, it is more about the story, lol

        Loading editor
    • Exactly. I know I for one would not care.

        Loading editor
    • I might just a little

        Loading editor
    • Maybe. Although I don't think that goes for a certain song.

        Loading editor
    • how so?

        Loading editor
    • Bringing this back to the thread's topic: Dany mentioned a neat thing on chat. For Queen Anne there is a historical figure, Anne of Austria. After her husband's death, Anne ruled, in France, in place of her son as regent until he came of age.

      I think it's worth a trivia point, personally, even if it is just a coincidence.

        Loading editor
    • Yeah, We should mention it. I'm wondering though, if Presi hadn't died would he have been Riliane's regent instead of Anne. Also, Marlon's king seems to be a bit of a reference to King Louis the 14th, who was known for having a lot of concubines (both offical and non-offical) and fathering numerous illigitimate offspring. 

        Loading editor
    • TP clarifies that Prime Minister Genesia was Alexiel's guardian. Presi then started the ruckus over Riliane after the plan to possess and manipulate Alexiel died on arrival. After the minister got desperate, he poisoned Genesia then got killed himself. It was unlikely, given all the controversy surrounding him, that he would've ever been let near Riliane.

        Loading editor
    • For Germaine's nickname (currently the "swordswoman in red armor"), what does everyone think of shortening that to the "Red-armored Swordswoman"? Personally, I'm not a big fan of the wordiness we currently have it yet so I'd be glad to have it streamlined. Thoughts?

        Loading editor
    • I don't have much of an opinion on either side. Therefore the best thoughts I can summon for this would be something along the lines of sure, why not.

        Loading editor
    • I like Swordswoman in Red Armor more. Sounds more heroic to me. >8I

        Loading editor
    • Octofan wrote: I like Swordswoman in Red Armor more. Sounds more heroic to me. >8I

      Well I guess that's the why not.

        Loading editor
    • I'm leaning more towards leaving it be. It's not like we haven't seen word-y nicknames before, hmm?

        Loading editor
    • Alright. If no one else agrees, then that ideas probably shot.

      Also, Amazon states the DoE: Act 1 manga will be 165 pages. Since the ratio between light novel and manga seems to be 1/4, I'm pretty sure we'll just be getting through the first 40 light novel pages up till Leonhart's funeral. Hopefully the other manga volumes will release frequently (throw your money at PHP so they'll release more faster!).

      That means we'll potentially be seeing Minis, Sohni Elphen, Asan and his brother, and maybe cameos by Prim, Kyle, Anne, Arth, Presi, and Genesia (depending on how much Ichika uses flashbacks during inner-monologues).

      I'd like at least Minis and Sohni to get their own pages, if the images we get in this volume are good. Maybe Asan too (still more substantial than Waiter >.>).

        Loading editor
    • I don't agree either~! <3 I like Swordswoman in Red Armor (See kouhai I spelled it right for you~).

      We should be expecting pages for some of these characters correct? Since Servy brought it up, wouldn't it be a good time to decide who we think should get pages verus who should not as a topic? (Sorry if I'm jumping a bit too ahead) It's good to plan these things just in case we get those pictures we've been waiting for a long time for~! I'll go ahead and cast a vote with Asan, Minis, Sohni, Ein, York, Minage and Yvette. (If the manga gets that far that is)

        Loading editor
    • Well that sounds like Ichika's been keeping herself busy. XD

      I'm looking forward to putting faces to some characters at long last~. Getting pages for Sohni, Minis, York, Minage, and Ein sound good to me~.

      "Armor" sempai! Don't forget the first "r" there~. ;P (Wonderful job, sempai~. <3)

        Loading editor
    • (I feel as though Presi might also be deserving of a page but I'm not sure <.<)

      On the one hand, I'm not sure if we should be comparing DoE minor characters to the Clockwork Lullaby main characters for page length, considering that the only reason they got pages was because they were main characters and not because they actually had enough content :P (So I am assuming anyway, I wasn't here when the pages were made.) And I don't know if it's just page length or also influence on the story that determines whether or not one is a minor character.

      On the other, the list for Daughter of Evil characters is really really long so I might possibly be okay with an Asan page just to take the pressure off so we can add more minor characters like Asan's brother.. It depends; maybe the manga will even give a little bit more to add to his page with flashbacks or dialogue embellishments. 

        Loading editor
    • I'd like to add Sekka and Mark to that list. They're smaller roles (but still more than Waiter, who shall be my standard of all things a page should not be).

      Yarera and Zusco also have some decent roles and I have a sneaking suspicion they are among the pirates that pop up in Praefatio, which would add even more to their appearances. Chelsea too, since she's a minor antagonist in Wiegenlied, and maybe Nikolay Tolle if he appears in flashbacks.

      There's also the unnamed character's to deal with, like Chartette's father and Clarith's mother.

      Edit: Add to Octo's words, I'm of the opinion that I'd like us to move eventually toward giving/most named or large-enough speaking role characters their own articles but that's just me. As long as we have a name and enough info to justify an article, I'm fine with it (and Waiter's my personal minimum bar).

        Loading editor
    • You and the Waiter-hate, guy.

      Okay. Welp. All a "minor character" means is you're not a main character and apparently not important enough at the moment to be detailed upon.
      Okay, that was lie.
      Don't take that seriously.
      But honestly, a character page should be based more on the amount of information there is--in my humble opinion.
      Or else....
      Or else...
      Well or else Waiter. And things of the sort.
      I'd like to get more character pages though. But before that, I'm just going to focus on some characters getting faces. O^O Faces are nice.

        Loading editor
    • If Yarera and Zusco are those pirates, then I'm fine with them getting pages. Although I'm rather uncertain of the others, though Waiter may be a "minimum bar" I feel like we shouldn't quite take that as an excuse to make more short pages. There have been so many pages written and made regardless of the information they may have lacked. '>> I'll leave my uncertainty at neutral.

      EDIT: Pika is with Resi-. XD

        Loading editor
    • I'm fine if Asan not getting a page either, the only thing he really does is attempt to stab Riliane, so I guess I'm fine with him not being added in. Other minor characters seem to do more then him like Presi, Genesia and a few others. Who knows, the manga could again add some insight that wasn't in the light novels. I want to cast in Shalgham the douchebag, Margaret, George Ausdin, Koopa as well.

      I'm not sure if I'd like seeing Clarith's mother and Chartette's father as page articles- that's just me though XD If we get names that would be nice~.

        Loading editor
    • I'm definitely for Koopa, Margaret, and George. Shalgham maybe but I don't think Ichika will be giving us DoF chars (unless we see old Yvette as a nun at the monastery).

      I'd suggest the other Ausdins but John only gets mentioned in passing (I think?) and Daniel has a very short scene with Clarith. He does have a few points indicating a back story but unless more is said about them in the Worldguide/Fanbook, I'd prefer they not get pages.

        Loading editor
    • DoE: Act 1 is out. My copy allegedly is coming in tomorrow so we'll see if it arrives or takes another day.

      Anyhow, looking at Riliane's birthday cake. It was definitely big (three times the size of the average male, for sure). I give credit for the pastier making that monstrosity within the same day it was demanded of... Of course not doing so would mean his beheading so yeah...

        Loading editor
    • Minis Minis Minis Minis Minis OUO

      That was not the size that Allen suggested it was in the novel 8[ But now it makes more sense about Leonhart getting angry and leaving. 

        Loading editor
    • It might be a mis-translation on our end. We'd have to have someone grab the Japanese from the line to make sure "about my height" wasn't something else. Keel also makes a big deal about it in Wiegenlied so perhaps Allen was just talking about the height of the base?

        Loading editor
    • Hey, what does everyone thing of using this has Gumillia avatar?
      Revolver

      I think it make sense to.

        Loading editor
    • It's a nice picture and all, but I'm not sure. Personally, I wouldn't want to her avatar. I think the other works just fine.

        Loading editor
    • I'm not for it, personally.

      Dat cake.

        Loading editor
    • That one cuts off too much imo and since she crying isn't really characteristic of her, I think it'd be a poor representation of the character.

        Loading editor
    • I think the problem is that it mischaracterizes her. Not only is Gumillia's role in the story most prominent during Story of Evil (though that can change this summer) but her character is that of a straight-laced, practical, and not very emotional figure. That avatar above picks her at an extremely strenuous time, and it's not representative of how she normally acts at all. That being said, there could be another potential avatar somewhere in that PV, because I kind of liked the "Dynamic picture" thing we had going. <.<;

      Edit: SoE got here first waaah

        Loading editor
    • If the manga has colored illustrations of the characters in each volume, we may get Gumillia in one of them. If it's a good clear pic of her face (not that Elluka one), we could use that. I'd like to use the one they have of Chartette, if we get a good quality pic of that.

      Edit: By the by, PHP is having a sign up till the end of the month for getting downloadable wallpapers as a gift. I signed up to the newletter like (I think?) it said but 24 hours later and nothing but an update on their products. If anyone here or at facebook can help figure it out and/or download and upload those wallpapers, that would be appreciated.

      Deadline for download is mid-March.

        Loading editor
    • My copy arrived today. From what i can tell, Leonhart hasn't been killed. Also Michaela and Clarith haven't met yet. 

        Loading editor
    • I suscribed to PHP Comix recently as well, but no updates whatsoever.

      According to the site, both the link to the wallpapers and password will arrive to your e-mailbox. Hopefully, something may happen in March.

        Loading editor
    • If we're subscribed and getting the newletter, then they'll probably send it eventually before the deadline, so maybe the beginning of March.

      Also, as for my copy, I'll highlight the major points:

      • First half is pretty much Chapter 1 Section 1 of Cloture, minus the last scene with Leonhart and Germaine, and with a good amount of new or added onto scenes (some taken out or shortened).
      • Second half is pretty much the first few scenes of Wiegenlied with Elluka except with a lot more added scenes for backstory, development, etc. (some taken out or shortened)
      • This manga does change details or events in some cases, so how we handle continuity and whether or not we deem this manga canon or non-canon, and what parts from it we will impliment into articles, if any, needs to be decided on.
      • Mariam looks like a completely different person "during the war" so it seems her hairstyle and maid outfit came in right at the end of the Twiright Prank story.
      • Minis is in the manga and gets a good infobox image-worthy face shot.
      • Even in this manga version, Riliane tried dressing up Allen like her little Doll (though only his hair it seems) on his first day.
      • Keel, Kyle, Anne, and Arth all make cameos.
      • It's very well illustrated. Good scans of this manga would be excellent for the wiki; Ichika did awesome with giving us images of establishing the setting and letting us have quality illustrations to look at.
      • Underneath the fabulous plastic cover, you've got a book with concept art littering it's front and back; nice touch.

      I'll see what scans I can get. It's a lot to take in and I'd like a second copy to arrive first before I completely tear apart this one.

        Loading editor
    • Yay! Im so excited for the manga! Woohoo ANNE! YAY CONCEPTS! (no Ein yet.. >.>)

      It would be a shame to consider the manga non-canon... we'll see...

      Which are the changed events/details?

      Also who are the characters in the 2nd half? Elluka Mariam Held Micha Gumillia and Clarith?

        Loading editor
    • Danytaly
      Danytaly removed this reply because:
      Yes
      19:26, February 18, 2014
      This reply has been removed
    • Danytaly
      Danytaly removed this reply because:
      Altright
      19:27, February 18, 2014
      This reply has been removed
    • Are you going to upload the manga?

        Loading editor
    • Danytaly wrote:

      It would be a shame to consider the manga non-canon... we'll see...

      Which are the changed events/details?

      Also who are the characters in the 2nd half? Elluka Mariam Held Micha Gumillia and Clarith?


      Personally, I think we should take the approach many large multi-media fanbases take with adaptations, deem it canon but only implement the stuff that doesn't outright contradict major parts of the manga. Adaptations are going to inevitably be different from the source material; I don't think it should be discredited because it has stuff that mothy's light novels didn't have. 

      To give some examples:

      Changed: Riliane doesn't run ahead embaressed toward the port town, forcing Allen to remind her of Josephine; they either remove or timeskip to when she's already on the horse.

      New: Leonhart and co. meet up with Riliane at the port town. Leonhart's angry and Riliane decides to calmly assert her dominance, giving them a speech before demanding they  kneel to her (Ichika's segway to get that line in there). They immediately do so, much to Leonhart's chagrin, as she just looks on with satisfaction at how they must obey their Princess.

      Leonhart, Arth, Anne, Allen, and co. are also in the second half. It's handled much like one continuous story and everything flows together very well. I think the fact there's a timeskip backwards is made pretty clear and the scenes that are added help keep it tight.

      I'll have a few scans up later today. Like I said, I won't be tearing this apart to make full scans of everything until I get a second copy. This deserves all the money that can be thrown at it for the quality it comes in imo.

        Loading editor
    • I've added a few pics I was able to crop and edit after scanning. For the purposes of articles, I'd like to ask what everyone prefers? I scan them in color but can desaturize them to be b&w:

      Rilianedevilunsat

      Unsaturated

      Rilianedevil

      Saturated

        Loading editor
    • So is there going to be a minis page?

        Loading editor
    • I prefer the unsaturated version. 

        Loading editor
    • @Misstress I think it was agreed upon earlier that there was going to be a Minis page or at least from a few of us. There's enough for a page, why not?

      I agree with Dany, unsaturated Riliane with me.

      So I guess canocity is what is being dicussed now? Let's be honest, most mangas don't usually follow the exact events that happened in the book, like Servy said it's a bit inevitable. However I believe if it follows most of the events that happened in the novels with little to few changes, then I'll give in my opinion and say canon.

        Loading editor
    • Yush! I can finally see what you guys have added to these discussion threads! ;u;

      I'm also for the unsaturated picture, the saturated one looks like it's shaded in a red-gray-ish scheme. Warm colours for manga pictures kind of bug me, so...

      As for the canocity of it, I'm kind of in the middle here. So long as we can all get a solid understanding of what we're saying is canon and what isn't, I'm fine with it. I just don't want there to be confusion. ><

        Loading editor
    • I guess I don't really have an opinion either way, both versions look good. I guess go with whatever color the manga originally had? <.< (Is this going in her Personality Section? Because I think an Evil smile is a perfect addition <3 )

      But yes, I'm certain Minis has enough for his own page. 

      Mmm, as far as canonicity is concerned, the major new things you've pointed out feel pretty plausible additions to the novel--especially if it covers events that were glossed over by a time skip previously, I'll say it'd be safe to add it into the history section.

        Loading editor
    • Hmm, I am preferring unsaturated as well. The scanner makes the thickest black brown, which I personally don't like either.

      If we're going to be add pieces, I suggest starting with what we just the visual information. It could take us a while before we get the dialogue scenes fully translated. But stuff like Riliane crying at her funeral, Allen watching her cry at it while in disguise, Mariam and Elluka attending it with the princess, Riliane running up to taste her cake while Leonhart stormed out, Chartette being assigned to Allen by Mariam after breaking something, etc. can all be added to articles and referenced to Act 1 without us needing the dialogue to understand the scene.

      Until then, I'll add the pictures I've gotten so far where appropriate.

        Loading editor
    • Heh.

      BLIND NO LONGER.

      Oh. Pieces it is then...:v
      I agree that it'd be shame to have to consider it non-canon.
      But even if it was, we could still use the illustrations, right, I mean hey-

        Loading editor
    • Please upload the part with the knife, i never understood it

        Loading editor
    • Misstress of the heavenly yard wrote:
      Please upload the part with the knife, i never understood it


      Wiegenlied translated it akwardly but visually, the manga just has it as a toy retractable knife. If Elluka actually stabbed Mariam, the toy blade would have just been pushed into the hilt.

        Loading editor
    • Ahhh. Thanks

        Loading editor
    • OH and one thing about the manga page, i think it's just easier if we have "volumes" instead of "plot summary" and the have a segment for each volumes with a link to the volume's page

        Loading editor
    • I've said this on chat before, but the current plan is to make an article for each manga volume in series, leaving the actual series page as a sort of directory. Once the book project is finished being posted, it will cover that as well.

      A
      ForestofBewilderment

      Forest suggestion

      s for pics, I've got another batch but here is major one I feel should be discussed first; my suggestion for a new Millennium Tree Forest image at the top of the page:


      GenesiaPresi

      Presi and Genesia?

      Then there is this image which may or may not clear up the ambiguity over Genesia's gender. I know many were leaning on the Prime Minister being female but the two sillohettes shown below are male while the "political dispute" is being narrated to the reader. You see Presi's bloodied, dead hand with the mirror in the next panel and he has the same cuffs as those two characters below. Thoughts?
        Loading editor
    • Seeing as both forest pictures are generally displayed in a monochromatic scale, the change won't affect the colour. The one we have now is fine, but I'll vote for changing it to your suggestion since that one seems to give a greater sense of the forest's location and such. (I must admit that I'm almost neutral though, the current lookes a bit "smoother" and less messy, so...)

      It seems possible, I wouldn't be all too shocked either really. "Genesia" sounds sort of like a girl's name to me, but it's easy to envision another guy in a political role such as Prime Minister.

        Loading editor
    • I am fine with the new suggestion for the Milennium Tree Forest page, gives more detail then the other one we have so I say okay.

      As for that other picture....it looks like two males to me. The person standing to Riliane can be a bit debatable but I'm leaning more towards male than female. Wasn't Sohni once thought to be female too previously? I mean it's not very unlikely that this could be the same.....

        Loading editor
    • From my understanding speculation surrounding Genesia's gender started up over the mention that the Prime Minister and "Anne" were doing something immoral. On top of which, there is a lot of talk about women growing in power from Presi's perspective.

      Neither of which directly implies Genesia would be female, but this was the reasoning behind the mindset, to my understanding. If Genesia is male, than perhaps Presi's inner monologue is more directed towards how Anne and his sister Prim (who both are mentioned in the topic) are the examples of this trend; he also brings up Elphegort and how it made way for the female prime minister idea so that might murky the waters a bit.

        Loading editor
    • True none of those things can actually state directly that Genesia is a female but we shouldn't be too surprised if there's a change in the future. Although then again.....there's no evidence directly stating that Genesia is a male either. I mean Ly Li kind of looked a bit like a male from the back in the cover of OSS -Act 2-, it wouldn't be far off if we just have a masculine girl here. XD

        Loading editor
    • Oh. Okay.

      If it still matters--the suggestion-picture for the Milennium Tree Forest page is nice. Nice things are nice.

      Oh. Uh.

        Loading editor
    • Adding another topic to the discussion: Checking titles that were in Cloture to confirm whether some were translation errors or mistake, particularly Mariam, Riliane, and Leonhart. I've got:

      • Head of Maids: She's addressed as 侍女長 which literally means maid head/head maid; I suppose "Head of Maids" works, albeit it's a slightly more creative as a translation. Thoughts on keeping/changing this on the wiki?
      • Queen: Our Cloture translation throws this around a lot; we know she says she refuses to be called such and this never comes up in articles but I thought it was important to keep in mind; in the manga at least, all characters during the Cloture scenes refer to her as 王女, meaning "Princess". This gets mistranslated a lot in fan subs too for DoE and SoE so this might be the same situation.
      • Commander of the Royal Guard: The text uses 親衛隊 隊長 which my dictionary has as imperial/royal guard commanding officer; the example sentence translates "commanding officer" as "captain" and I know I've heard taichou translated as Captain numerous times. Perhaps "Captain of the Royal Guard" would be a better translation? It's more recognizeable for the position, imo.

      As far as Genesia goes, I think arguing that's a manly looking female would be hard since even with Ly Li, those that thought she was a male (myself included) recognized the character had a thin enough figure to be a woman. On top of which, the character of Genesia is noted as crude and a bit lustful, but not as a tomboy dressed in male clothes. At least for me, that seems like a stretch for the illustration being made.

        Loading editor
    • The only translation that bugs me is Leonhart's rank/position. I'm trying to find some kind of "Rank list" in what Royal Guard is about but with no fruition so far (for some reason, I get references to Star Wars... A LOT), so I guess a bit more of research is necessary.

      And about Genesia's gender... why not ask Ichika herself?

      She seems to be answering some questions regarding the manga, such as: "How does Sonhi Elphen looks like?" (which she answered as "secret until official debut")

      However, the question must be clear enough for her to understand since she's still learning english.

        Loading editor
    • YESFINALLY

      Technically I mean maybe there's a set uniform for Prime Ministers and it just happens to look like male wear. Or through some odd happenstance that isn't Presi and Genesia at all in that picture. 8V But I agree it's getting more and more likely Genesia is male. 

      As for the Millenium Tree Forest, I actually kind of like the picture we already have ^ ^; It conveys the mysterious and dark nature of the forest better, in my opinion, and the other one just doesn't really look all that nice for the main page image. Maybe it could be an image for the Forest of Bewilderment, instead of the Hansel and Gretel picture? (I feel that's misleading anyway, since we don't know where in the forest the twins were.) Although wait, where did that image come from? Is it the Lucifenian or Elphen side?

      I approve of Head Maids and Captain for a new translation, unless there is a precedent that suggests Commander is more accurate (of which, your dictionary has the opposite, so...)

        Loading editor
    • My vote is for keeping Head of Maids. Because let's not lie. I like how it sounds.
      As you've gathered, I get captain as for a translation as well; 'Commander' itself has a nice little set unique to it--so I'm for changing it.

        Loading editor
    • MaxusFox23 wrote:
      The only translation that bugs me is Leonhart's rank/position. I'm trying to find some kind of "Rank list" in what Royal Guard is about but with no fruition so far (for some reason, I get references to Star Wars... A LOT), so I guess a bit more of research is necessary.


      Don't look under royal guard; you'll just keep getting Palpatine's elite unit. Check under royal guard captain or commander and proper results come up. The term for royal guard commanders and captains is used seemingly interchangeably. However, most results for fiction and fantasy crop up as "Captain" on my end.

      MaxusFox23 wrote:

      And about Genesia's gender... why not ask Ichika herself?

      Question was posed a few days ago but no answer's come back yet. She's probably busy, given the new release. It'd also be best we don't try using her as a consistent crutch; I'm sure answering a flurry of fan questions thrown at her gets a bit cumbersome, especially when its not her native language.

      Octofan wrote:

      [snip]

      It's of the Lucifenia side. It's the establishing shot before they show the search party. I'm not opposed to it being used for the FoB, although it may need to be cropped so it isn't so wide there.

        Loading editor
    • Maybe you know this already, but Ichika replied that Presi and Genesia are indeed two men; Daughter of Evil: Act 2 will be released in November 2014 and the whole series will be from 5 to 10 volumes.

        Loading editor
    • Ichika confirmed: It is minis and presi and act:2 will be released in november

        Loading editor
    • oh an there will be abot 10 volumes

        Loading editor
    • Clarification: "Maybe, I think total volumes is 5~10."

      That's not a very a solid number; just an estimate. The November release date seems to be at least the currently scheduled one and proves she's already been cleared to work on the next. I think a lot of fan are going to be disappointed with the long wait time between volumes but it's to be expected, for their quality.

      She answered my question regarding Presi to Genesia and didn't deny when I said "two men" so I think that clears up that argument. I think it's safe to assume Presi's the one near Riliane and Genesia's the one near Alexiel; anyone disagree?

        Loading editor
    • nope

        Loading editor
    • If no one else has an issue with it, then here are my suggestions for avatars for the two, similarly to how we handled Mikulia's handler, son, and husband.

      Genesiamanga

      Genesia

      Presimanga

      Presi

        Loading editor
    • Sure they could even  pass for pages...well if there is more to them

        Loading editor
    • I think no one is against to change the image of the Lucifenian Royal Palace page and the Heavenly yard image with ichika's manga ones. Also is there other good images for the Port Town, Anonymous Coast, Servants' Room, Riliane's Room or the Avadonia Residence?

        Loading editor
    • Although I can't see everything that was just here, I think I remember them....
      And I was against nothing.

        Loading editor
    • Let's hope wikia will be fixed soon so this discussion will be easier. Since the book project is finally posted, I'm throwing in an all clear to change Leonhart's title to Captain of the Royal Guard, keep Head of Maids as is, make the change to Genesia's gender wherever it comes up in articles, and add Presi and G's avatars to their minor character box.

      As for them having their own articles, maybe Presi but Genesia is never even seen alive in TP. Presi has a decent amount of scenes; I'd say one or two less than Minis. I'm in the middle for him.

      Danytaly wrote:
      I think no one is against to change the image of the Lucifenian Royal Palace page and the Heavenly yard image with ichika's manga ones. Also is there other good images for the Port Town, Anonymous Coast, Servants' Room, Riliane's Room or the Avadonia Residence?

      What you see is what you get, except for maybe Elluka's room. I'm fine with changing the royal palace page. While the current one is in color, I like the manga's design more. Heavenly Yard could be replaced with that nighttime scene I added, though a day scene may work better.

      I'd like the port town to get its own section, since we're incorporating manga info into the continuity. We probably won't see the Avadonia Residence until the scene between Germaine and Leonhart (if it occurs) happens.

        Loading editor
    • Servant of Evillious
      Servant of Evillious removed this reply because:
      Inappropriate to the discussion.
      05:07, February 22, 2014
      This reply has been removed
    • I'm for the idea of changing the Palace page.
      And Presi having an article--I don't have really a strong opinion on this.
      If the score is higher then barely passing.
      I'd like more pretty pictures of Mr. Rogzé. At least a face-looking face. ;v;
      I mean I doubt he's that pretty, but you know.

      I'm very happy with what we got for Minis. UvU

        Loading editor
    • I feel like Presi might be more along the range of Scherzer, in terms of whether or not he deserves a page. <.< Thoses images look pretty poor quality up close, as well. Too many dots. Okay for a minor character section, but I don't know about how good they would be for avatars. 

      Annnd I am okay with the other changes. 

        Loading editor
    • I've got another image I decided to siphon. A bit small and has the flashback grain but might work. Here is a shot of the battlefield from the asmo-beelz war. Lots of cross imagery in this one.

      Warflashback

      Crosses and wasteland and torn flags, oh my!

        Loading editor
    • Looks dandy.

      I think it'd be swell.

      JUST SWELL.

        Loading editor
    • I'm fine with it as well~.

        Loading editor
    • Well I have no objections so... (This took so many tries to post... >>)

      *USP is in.

        Loading editor
    • I'm fine with it as well, it looks good.

        Loading editor
    • I like it as well. Unless I see a surge of nay's, we'll add it then.

      Also, it looks like PHP is updating on twitter about those wallpapers and lottery for getting a signed manga and have a blogpost on it now. It sounds like they may start sending the email at the end of this week or next week for those interested in downloading it. So I guess those signed up just have to wait.

        Loading editor
    • So, ummm 8V there was talk of using that sample picture as a Chartette avatar? The pigtails look a little short to me, though, so suddenly I'm less sure. <o<

        Loading editor
    • Looks right in my copy. Goes down to her eye level, like her Interlude concept art.

      I'd like to use one of the promo wallpapers (assuming the PC ones are high quality). I could scan my manga but that pic will have the crease over her head ruining it.

        Loading editor
    • 8O ohh, I see what it is, it's actually the bangs that are too short.

      I guess I'd be okay with it kind of though <u<; since the only other good pic we have is of Praeludium's back cover and she looks uncharacteristically serious there. 

        Loading editor


    • Got the

      downloads. Here's a Chartette:
      Chartetteavatar

      Chartette








      Also, there are still my Allen avatar options in case anyone would prefer a different avi for him. There's also the Cloture cover illustration.

      Allenavatar2

      Allen 2








      Other than that; we got some scans of The Memorandum of Evil benefits booklet from Praelud. There are some splotches ruining a few scans but most of them were salvageable and added to galleries already.

      Demon-possessed Kyle. <3

        Loading editor
    • So I'd say yay for Allen's new avatar.

      NO FOR CHARTETTE!

      N-O

      SHE LOOKS SO CREEPY!

      WHY ICHIKA

      What did Chartette ever do to you..!

        Loading editor
    • Servant of Evillious
      Servant of Evillious removed this reply because:
      Redundant
      16:44, February 26, 2014
      This reply has been removed
    • i like it

        Loading editor
    • I like the Allen, but how about Praeludium for chartette's avatar
      Avachar

      Like this?

        Loading editor
    • Or we can choose this: 
      Chartetteavatar

      Chartette's avatar

        Loading editor
    • I really dislike VocaloFan's one.. I think it's better her maid outfit than her war outfit (Just like we use Doe and not Rin for Riliane's infobox image).

        Loading editor
    • The attire's irrelevant imo. I dislike Voca's suggestion for the style. I find Yuu's artwork a bit too stylized. I wouldn't mind Misstress' if the image wasn't so small and low quality.

        Loading editor
    • Here
      Avachar2

      this time i cut from the poster

        Loading editor
    • Retried with the novel trailer
      Trailer char

      Might have been even more fail

        Loading editor
    • The size of the avatar isnt adjustible on the page

        Loading editor
    • If we're going to be posting whatever art we have, then might as well add this to the
      Chartetteavatar2

      Chartette; also 2x3

      table:
        Loading editor
    • Yay for the concept art of Chatette as her avatar.

        Loading editor
    • I agree with Dany's yay. Although it's virtually the same picture.

      I also agree with the notion that Chartette looks somewhat creepy in that one illustration...

        Loading editor
    • I disagree with you, I agree that Misstress's image is better than my image, but it's better than yours.

        Loading editor
    • I agree with Respi and Dany, the first is somewhat creepy, I agree with Servy's statement about the Yuu's artwork and I'd go with Mistress' suggestion but it's too small, if had one that fit well than I would have went with that but we don't have one currently. So the one with her concept art is what I am voting for.

        Loading editor
    • But this would happen just like when we choosed to change the avatar of Elluka, the former avatar of Elluka was like Servant's image.

        Loading editor
    • I'm gonna have to cast my vote with using the concept art. This is partially on the basis that the Wallpaper Chartette looks creepy with her misplaced eyes and short bangs. I dislike Misstress' suggestion as well, though, because not only is it too small, but I believe it mischaracterizes Chartette. I mean, she's frowning. 8C

      Chartette as a character is basically so carefree that she can't even be possessed by a demon. Sure, she's serious when she has to be, as that picture demonstrates, but that's not anyone's first impression of her in-universe.

      It is unfortunate that the concept art is the same as the "official headshot" we have on there right now, and I wish a more useable "dynamic" picture was available, but I think it's the best option at the moment. (Technically I think it's only important we not use the "official headshots" for avatars since they aren't universally available, not that we don't use the picture itself.) 

        Loading editor
    • I shall cast my vote in with the favour of the majority, the concept art looks better to me in a way. Octo is also very convincing at times.

        Loading editor
    • To tally what we have so far, I'm seeing:

      Praelud cover = 1

      Praelud illust = 1

      Interlude Profile = 5

      Since I'm fine with any save for the Yuu illustration, so I guess that could count as another vote for Interlude, although I'm not bugged by the DoE one either (or the Praelud cover if we could get a good quality ver.).

      I think I'm getting the general consensus. Alright I'll update the new Chartette one for now.


      Moving onto the next big thing. I think now's a good time to discuss the Comedy of Evil Project, since their first volumes come out this week and we just had the new chapters release.

      mothy's hasn't updated his blog this time around so it looks like he will be skipping his overview of 2013 releases; might double up next year. Either way, we wont' get potential clarification on canocity from him for another year at least.

      Which leaves us with just what we have already.

      I don't think anyone is going to debate Aku Musu as being non-canon. It's a straight up crack comedy like Tamara's yonkoma shorts.

      Opera Buffa's been in a sort of ambiguous spot for a while now but I think the latest chapter helps cement my opinion at least.

      I think it's non-canon.

      Even within the bounds of a comedy's suspension of disbelief, most of the cast act out of character, especially with Allen (both personality and hair style was Len-ized imo). The only one that seems to resemble their light novel incarnation is Ney.

      Similarly, the events don't seem to match up. Allen is made fully aware of the Demon of Pride even though he's supposed to be completely oblivious in Cloture. Riliane and Allen also seem to get intimate really early on compared to how Cloture portrays it and Elluka having another option besides training Gumillia to help eliminate the Demon isn't even referenced in the books. And now, with the newest chapter, Germaine sees Allen and Riliane at the palace, even though Cloture was explicit that she didn't visit the palace, see Allen since he became a servant, or ever meet Riliane beforehand.

      Beyond this entire story arc ending in everyone suddenly haveing amnesia that resets everything back to square one (making this entire storyline pointless anyway imo), I don't see how this can be rectified with the existing continuity, even in parts.

      That's what I gather from this overall.

        Loading editor
    • I must be frank that I haven't followed the Comedy of Evil in general. :U I've just heard/ read about it.

      From what I've gathered though, Aku Musu looks pretty much completely non-canon to me, with it's general style, comedic spin, and what few translations I've seen of it. Opera Buffa was questioned more when it got "serious" if memory serves. However, seeing as countless events in it are innaccurate any how for one reason or another (like Alexiel being called Allen before he was canonically given the name, the personification of the demon of pride, and other examples Servy gave), my perception of it is just as non-canon as Aku Musu.

      So I basically second the opinion...

        Loading editor
    • I'm right along with Pika in the not following it aspect.

      I assumed they'd come out as non-canon anyway, I mean it's the comedy of evil. If they were canon, I'd need a very long break from everything. With everything brought up here, I'm going to agree with the above opinions.

      I'm also going to say that I find the term Len-ized interesting.
      When -ified just doesn't cut it.

        Loading editor
    • Agreed with Servy for Comedy of Evil. Although I haven't checked up on Aku musu.. Opera Buffa just has So so so so so so much wrong with it (Servy's reasons). I think my head would spin if it was canon. Allen is too OOC in Opera buffa.. I miss sarcastic and just plain downer at times Allen.

        Loading editor
    • I think one of my favorite Allen scenes in The Daughter of Evil: Act 1 was when he has a flashback of Mariam assigning him to help Chartette. Mariam gives a generic excuse for why he needs to do so and it flashes back to him staring at her (you don't see his expression but the shading sets the atmosphere) going, "Yeah, that's the reason..." when Allen obviously saw Chartette had broken something at the time.

        Loading editor
    • <.<; Um, I go with the idea that Buffa is non-canon. I mean tiny Allen has a whole 'nother outfit in that manga, where is his tie. Even pressing out all the things done for humor's sake, and assuming that amnesia affects all the cast (which apparently doesn't cause any problems with people trying to remember such a huge chunk of time) the plothole of Elluka exorcising the demon with barely any effort and no consequences to Riliane seems like a pretty big thing in light of Wiegenlied.

      Aku Musu, definitely non-canon. (Leonhart is still alive, isn't he? And yet the Green Hunting has already started?)

        Loading editor
    • I have no idea if there even has been a Green Hunting in Aku Musu. Last chapter was just about Clarith going crazy, Kyle being a Slender Man, and Elluka being reminded why everyone's an idiot.

        Loading editor
    • Personally, I had always thought Opera Buffa was always non-canon. I never really kept track of it but ever since I saw that one scene with Riliane being possessed by a demon and her wearing that skimpy outfit with tattoes, I always thought it wasn't in the continuity. But since you guys mentioned all those good points, I agree with the decision of it being labelled non-canon.

        Loading editor
    • Servy, you mentioned that we should bring up making a page on gou-chan after the first volume came out

        Loading editor
    • That was before we were questioning about where it was canon or not-. I mean I understand if there were a few misconceptions placed within the text but there's a lot of things that just don't add up. I don't think there should be a page for Gou-chan >u>;

        Loading editor
    • Alright. Looks like no one's bringing up a good argument for the manga. Alright; then we'll label it as non-canon till circumstances prove otherwise.

      Next up is characters. Since we're dealing with non-canon serial manga that may or may not bring up new characters, how do you feel they should be treated? There's the Memento path we took but we could also try adding their own character page or list. Thoughts?

      Edit: Looks like I got ninja'd.

        Loading editor
    • I'm fine with taking the Memento path. Since this is all for humor's skae I think it's just the personality and events that don't happen to add up, but I don't think there should be pages just because of that. It's funny seeing the characters do thing that they typically wouldn't do or satrize them in hilarious ways, but pages because of that...? I say nay. ;p

        Loading editor
    • I meant like we should put sings saying "this character is non canon" or "this story is non canon"

        Loading editor
    • We'll probably never have to put "this character is non-canon" if we aren't making pages for them. I'm neutral for stating if an article is non-canon though. It's not really necessary in my opinion, if we already have a category for it. If it truly becomes a problem that people don't notice what's been placed in there though, I'd be fine with it.

      Y'know, while we're on the subject... Oh hey, speaking of which, I don't see Aku Musu or Opera Buffa categorized in there yet.

      I'll just... go do that...

        Loading editor
    • Well, 'though Gou-chan doesn't deserve an article, I think we still need add the Demon of Pride into Comedy of Evil article, after all, she is a stable character into the story.

        Loading editor
    • Since Gou-chan's not a canon character, I would be against giving her an article (it's similar to us not making articles for the Rin and Len characters in the Servant of Evil manga, by my reasoning.) Besides which, I'm not sure if we even have enough on her to flesh it out enough since, to my knowledge, no one has translated her segments. 

      I agree with Adept, though, there should be an indication of her existing somewhere. Possibly a trivia point on the Sin of Pride's article too, since it is a noteworthy portrayal of the demon.

        Loading editor
    • Want to point out we already have a trivia on the demon:

      "In The Servant of Evil ~Opera Buffa!~, the Demon is called ゴーちゃん (Gou-chan), likely a pun on 傲慢 (gouman), meaning "pride"."

      I'm for the default; let's list them as a character in Appearances like we have for other non-canon material. We do it for  SoE manga's Rin and Len or the Asmodean Emperor (although I'd argue he should have a small section) so it makes sense imo.

        Loading editor
    • While the trivia part is true, I was thinking we should expand on it a little to make it clear that the "Gou-chan" is a character derived from the Demon, or something of that nature, with Riliane's shape and personality and everything. >o>

        Loading editor
    • I agree with no article--it just really doesn't make much sense to me to have one--and I'm with a small mention as well....
      ....
      Yeah.

        Loading editor
    • I'm counting a majority in favor of just listing it; we'll add a secondary trivia as well to clarify that the Demon takes on Riliane's appearance when exorcised from the Princess and imprisoned by Elluka.

      And now, given that Opera Buffa has been labeled non-canon, how does everyone feel about us using those images outside of galleries? We know Ichika's moved on from her original castle design that Opera Buffa adopted in favor of a Versaille-inspired design. What about the other locations we see in Lucifenian and Lucifenian Royal Palace?

        Loading editor
    • Hmm, I don't know, since the castle design has actually been changed from Opera Buffa, it seems like all the other pictures have a higher chance of being inaccurate. 8V

        Loading editor
    • I agree with Octo, if the areas are as simple as lets say the stables or something, I see no problems but for areas of more bigger importance, I don't really agree.

        Loading editor
    • I'm going to have to agree with this. It's best we avoid using non-canon portrayals if some have already shown inconsistencies. We'll keep them out for now, unless another canon portrayal adopts the designs.

      I do want to bring up one thing that I think's been floating around for a bit. In TP, Mariam's inner-monologue states this:

      "A simple man. I envied his simplicity, and yet, he was very pleasant to be with. Even though I felt so, this senseless man senselessly didn’t know my feelings."

      Based on this, does anyone else agree Mariam is implying she has romantic feelings for Leon? I can't think of too many other situations where a line like this could have another meaning.

        Loading editor
    • I suppose I'm late with this now- but I'm also up for having a lack of non-canon portrayals if something else pops up. Canon is more favourable~.

      It sound like that would be the case, to me... I hope not though, we don't really need shipper fuel. Imeanreallywhydoesromancegetincorporatedintoeverything-isitthatnecessary? 

        Loading editor
    • That's what my mind goes straight to. I don't know if the Japanese have another connotation for it....

        Loading editor
    • It could just be a strange translation. A lot of what the characters say could be taken as a hint of a romantic relationship but almost always don't mean that. (I'm more amused by her word choice with "senseless man senselessly", to be honest.)

        Loading editor
    • Lemmings' point does give way to the possibility of a strange translation, in my opinion--but, a slightly different translation may just very obviously mean the same thing.

        Loading editor
    • Even if she's not canon i still think she's a page worthy character, she has a definet personality and has connections

        Loading editor
    • Hmm..... Well, what Miriam says does hint at possible romantic feelings; but as Lemmings stated the way it's worded could mean it is an odd translation.

      As for Gou-chan, I don't think she should have a page if she isn't a canon character, it might cause confusion for some people (since some people don't really read) and if we did that we'd have to start making pages for any non-canon character.

        Loading editor
    • I agree with that, I can sense the romantic vibe coming off it but it could be an odd translation for it.

      I feel like if we make a page for Gou-chan, we'd have to make pages for Princess Rin and Prince Len from the Servant of Evil manga. I mean, they too have personalites and character connections but we didn't for the same reasoning that some of us don't agree with Gou-chan page. I am with the Daughter on this one, we make things more confusing by adding pages for characters that are not even canon? Makes things even more confusing than it actually is. I think the trivia we have on the Pride page is enough for her.

        Loading editor
    • I don't agree with Gou-chan having a page. With her being a non-canon character, she really doesn't need much more than a mention. And as Daughter argued, it'd cause too much unnecessary confusion.

      That said, I will say that I feel it is slightly different from the Servant of Evil manga. The Comedy of Evil is much more Evillious-related than the SoE manga is, but....non-canon is non-canon.
      I'm in agreement with Evils--a mention is enough.

        Loading editor
    • In my ever so humble opnion, I believe non-canon characters should not have their own pages. Giving Gou-chan a page means eventually other characters will all have to have their own pages (and may I add, there are quite a lot of them, what with Memento and SoE manga?) and this seems to me to be a brilliant way to confuse the masses. The majority of new EC fans come to the wiki from Story of Evil on YouTube and its massive collection of un-canon fan-made videos (spinoff songs, fanmade PVs, dubs, fauty subs, people in comments who have no idea what they're talking about but talk about it anyway, etc.). They often have a hard time accepting that all the non-canon is, well, non-canon, and Riliane Lucifen d'Autriche is the true and canon Daughter of Evil. Now, imagine if they walked in to see Riliane Lucifen d'Autriche and Memento's Princess Rin and SoE maga's Princess Rin and... I believe we can all see the problem with this situation.

        Loading editor
    • (I had this idea which I thought might be relevant in light of the Gou-chan discussion.)

      What do you people think of making a "non-canon character list," like a Minor Character List, at some point? Since giving them all their own pages would cause confusion, we could set this up to nonetheless give information to fans looking into them and still make it perfectly clear they are not in the canon EC by the title alone. 

      Of course, there would have to be certain criteria about what characters we include so we don't open up floodgates. I'd say we only include characters who were created by (or in a story created by) someone affiliated with Mothy/Mothy himself. Furthermore, the story would have to be Evillious related in some way (that's probably a given, but still.)

      So, characters like Gou-chan, the Desert Bluebird kids (pending confirmation it's not canon?) the South North Story Rin, etc. would be included, but fanon characters like the Red Maiden in Daughter of Revenge or characters from other Mothy works like the Yellow Phospherous girl would not be included. I'm not even sure the SoE manga characters would be included, since Mothy merely promoted their manga. 

      Thoughts? ^ ^;

      • Edit* SoE, you need to embolden your suggestions so I realize that you made them >8I
        Loading editor
    • I think I'd agree with this idea, especially with those conditions. So Octo did it again, that dern persuasive gal. It may be weird to keep track of with the names though, would they all be getting named the same thing...? >>

        Loading editor
    • Now I know when you don't read my replies, Octo. :P

      Seeing Lemmings' argument and then your suggestion, I am inclinded to side with Lemmings. To take your same example, the Desert Blubird kids have nothing on them beyond their own song. Similarly, setting the bar at "affiliated" with mothy is nearly anyone who releases a product with his permission, such as the SoE manga, which couldn't have an official release otherwise. I feel the difference between a list or an individual article is negligible, personally.

        Loading editor
    • I see the idea. With that, there could be a little more elaboration on the world of non-canon.

      Personally, I'm still not for it. At least now, I don't know about at some point. I still fail to see the need to elaborate on what is non-canon in the Evillious Chronicles. In my mind, that would be more work that the fans of EC and Wiki users may or may not be too concerned about.
      Some may also try to make connections from this non-canon thing to that canon thing and there'd have to be much emphasis on the non-canon part--but you seem like you're prepared for that.
      Even so, I'll just say I'm passing on the idea, but these are just my thoughts.

        Loading editor
    • Now abot Comedy of Evil, it's evident we're going to need split the article in the future, as more chapters, more characters and more info keeps appearing. Also, we need begin to summarize the info of the chapters (those ones had been available in the FB group, all this time). 

      I think we could add a small profile of the characters in similar fashion to the Association template in Vocaloid Wiki, including how they're depicted, so in that way the people could compare and contrast the satirical version against the respective canonical counterpart.

        Loading editor
    • SianaLuuna
      SianaLuuna removed this reply because:
      not the right place
      21:55, March 4, 2014
      This reply has been removed
    • I'm probably really late in realizing this, but could the Pride-possessed Kyle having six wings be a reference to Lucifer? In the Bible, Lucifer was said to have the highest rank an angel could have, which means he was a Seraphim. Seraphim have six wings.

        Loading editor
    • I'm also thinking that could be the case. Does anyone know anything about Asmodeus that could relate to Venomania's demon form? The picture on Wikipedia only seems to match up in being a mismash of animal parts. 

        Loading editor
    • The Demons and their depictions vary depending on the era, artist, and interpretation. Off the top of my head, I can't think of too many for Asmodeus. Lucifer too also gets depicted like other angels in many forms of media.

      Still, I like to think the six wings was an intentional call back to the seraphim. And yes, I believe the six-winged transformation connection to Lucifer was brought up somewhere before, a while back.

        Loading editor
    • GreekTelepath wrote:
      I'm probably really late in realizing this, but could the Pride-possessed Kyle having six wings be a reference to Lucifer? In the Bible, Lucifer was said to have the highest rank an angel could have, which means he was a Seraphim. Seraphim have six wings.

      wasn't Lucifer God's Second hand man until he tried to over throw God?

        Loading editor
    • Am i'm sounding whiny for bringing up Ichika again?

        Loading editor
    • Alexiel Lucifen wrote:
      GreekTelepath wrote:
      I'm probably really late in realizing this, but could the Pride-possessed Kyle having six wings be a reference to Lucifer? In the Bible, Lucifer was said to have the highest rank an angel could have, which means he was a Seraphim. Seraphim have six wings.
      wasn't Lucifer God's Second hand man until he tried to over throw God?

      Lucifer was indeed one of God's angels. But he was cast out of heaven for his pride believing he was better than god and disagreeing over humans having free will.

        Loading editor
    • I doubt that Mothy is going to include that into the Demon of Pride, seeing his existing backstory. He draws on Lucifer's themes a little, but he's not Lucifer.

      As for Misstress's comment, what are you bringing up about Ichika exactly...? o.o

        Loading editor
    • So can this Seraphim reference be put in the Sin of Pride's trivia, or is it too loose of a connection?

        Loading editor
    • There was a discussion on giving her a page

        Loading editor
    • Well I personally think it's enough of a connection, some of these demonic transformation might be a bit inspired by the demons themselves so I don't think Seraphim is too much off the mark.

      I am just going to bring back a few things from before if no one minds, I think with the discussion about Chartette's new avatar we forgot about poor Allen, I say that the one from the manga looked really nice and would do him well. I also want to bring up changing Gumillia avatar to her profile picture from Entr'acte, just like we did for Chartette, Leonhart and Mariam~.

      GumilliaAvi

      I am not even sure if this is 2x3 but let's just pretend it is ehehehehe- ^^;

      This is just an example, unlike Servy I am a bit clueless when it comes to image sizes- skladfjaslk.

      EDIT: There you go Lemmings- =3=

        Loading editor
    • that is good

        Loading editor
    • In order to be as annoying as possible, I shall point out that the name is no longer "Interlude" but "Entr'acte".

        Loading editor
    • My only concern is how the shade of green comes out in that scan compared to the website avatar. Might be fixable though with a little tweaking. I'll fix the proportion ratio too so it matches Gallerian's. Reposting so we don't have to do much scrolling back and forth.

      Allenavatar2

      Allen 2

        Loading editor
    • If anyone needs it, here's the character chart from the Wiegenlied of Green's site (old TDoE novel site). A lot of dust on it, but I consider it one of my rare jewels :)
      Character 18

      Quite big, isn't it?

        Loading editor
    • 8V I like the new avatar idea for Gumillia. Not sure about Allen's picture from the manga, though, I kind of like what we have for him-- (although my opinion counts little in this discussion because I liked the old Riliane picture too. ^ ^; )

        Loading editor
    • My only issue with this pic (and any of the color DoE pics I suppose) is that they all look odd/dead in this. I really do feel these were "phoned in" at the end for the manga because the quality looks a lot worse than what Ichika's done for the recent novels and albums imo.

      I feel there could be a better one for Allen. At the same time, I don't see anything particularly wrong with this image for him that we can't use it, so I'm ultimately neutral.

      By the way, thanks for posting that, Maxus; anything else from the fossil years you can dig up would be appreciated.

        Loading editor
    • I think we need some sort of special thread for avatar suggestions

        Loading editor
    • I got somethings here if you're interested:

      Poster1


      - The full cast list of TDoE musical (The best part of it? Asami Shimoda was the narrator of the play)



      Mikufood4

      "Oh my, it's snack time" - Themed dessert for TDoE.

      Mikufood5

      "Today's snack is Brioche" - Themed dessert for TSoE.







      - GS Cafe made a event long ago called "Project Mirai Cafe", and they made 2 desserts themed after TDoE and TSoE.


      Prae 3

      Page 1

      Prae 4

      Page 2










      - Praeludium of Red's Illustrator's Comments section.

        Loading editor
    • Neat.

      To make sure Adept's topic doesn't get forgotten either, there was the suggestion to change Asmo-Beelzenian War to Lucifenian Expansion War. Both have a nice ring to them, imo. The latter might have more clarity though.

        Loading editor
    • Personally if we'd go the route of making it about Lucifenia (which would be a lot clearer) I would prefer it be worded as the Lucifenian War of Expansion. It's a little wordier but "Wars of Expansion" is a phrase I've heard often, whereas "Expansion War" seems less common to me. I could be wrong, though, since it's just my experience talking.

        Loading editor
    • Speaking from personal experience, the term Asmo-Beelzenian War confused the heck out of me when I first came here and I assume many other had the same reaction. I greatly support the idea of a name change. Personally, I like the "Lucifenian War of Expansion" better, but it's not a big deal.

        Loading editor
    • I agree to the name change in Asmo-Beelzenian War because at first look it really confused me until I read the entire article and I was expecting to see Asmodean and Beelzenia battle it out or something. Just overall, it's very misleading title. I am fine with Lucifenian Expansion War or Lucifenian War of Expansion, although the latter seems to be a bit wordy for my tastes. But I'm neutral to either one.

        Loading editor
    • HIIII i have a question are they still making the evillous chronicles 

        Loading editor
    • Evils Theater wrote:
      I agree to the name change in Asmo-Beelzenian War because at first look it really confused me until I read the entire article and I was expecting to see Asmodean and Beelzenia battle it out or something. Just overall, it's very misleading title. I am fine with Lucifenian Expansion War or Lucifenian War of Expansion, although the latter seems to be a bit wordy for my tastes. But I'm neutral to either one.

      Or Luficenian Militarist Expansionism, isn't it?

        Loading editor
    • 76.100.18.37 wrote:
      HIIII i have a question are they still making the evillous chronicles 

      I am a little confused by the question so this may not answer it: Yes.

      VocaloFan.01 wrote:

      Or Luficenian Militarist Expansionism, isn't it?

      That's just overcomplicating the term imo.

        Loading editor
    • Alright, Lucifenian Expansion War's going forward.

      Next up, I was wondering if we should shorten the translation of The Daughter of Evil: BGM Collection for Reading to "The Daughter of Evil: BGM Reading Collection" instead. Thoughts?

        Loading editor
    • D'aww, War of Expansion. T~T 

      But yes for BGM Reading Collection I think it might possibly cause some confusion on whether or not we are reading something in the BGM but I don't mind that much. 

        Loading editor
    • Mm, I'm fine with it.

        Loading editor
    • I'm agree

        Loading editor
    • Oh. Yeah, Reading Collection. I agree.

        Loading editor
    • Alright, with my vote also for the change, that'll be the consensus; we'll push that forward too. Which means...

      Fanbook aftermaths! The compendium post's still a work in progress but we now have a lot of our major info more readily accessible than ever.

      I still need to check a lot of the text Lemmings transcribed for errors (if anyone could help with that, that'd be great) but we can now go through and check over info and the sequence of events.

      Just to post a few for discussion:

      • EC 500: (Yukina) receives a notebook from her mother for her birthday; they move to Marlon and Yukina publishes her first book afterward.  (Yukina's timeline)
      • EC 505: (Lily) returned to the Lucifenian army almost immediately after Retasan coup. (Lily's aftermath and timeline)
      • Levianta Catastrophe was said to have been caused by a magic accident during an experiment at the royal institute. (Levianta Catastrophe info under Elluka)
      • Elluka learns of Julia's identity as Irina through her letter (Lemy the Ripper Incident info under Freesis')
      • EC 505: (Chartette) joins Retasan coup. (Chartette's timeline)
        Loading editor
    • >u>

      <u<;;

      I feel as though Yukina becoming a Marlon sensation makes it weird that Chartette was able to read her books. 

      And the Catastrophe info we already know, but I still think it's interesting we even have people speculating that far considering everyone involved was killed (except like four people-.) Do you think it's possible that some other people did manage to miraculously survive, like if they were in a bunker? <o< And if so, that the royal institute was making an experiment around that same time? (Maybe the experiment was impregnating Irina for all we know.)

      As for the Julia thing, to be clear this doesn't mean Elluka didn't find out Irina was alive by Abyss IR, right? She just didn't know Irina had survived beyond that point. 

      Also what is this about a coup in Retasan? ouo

        Loading editor
    • just what we need, Irina to have kids

        Loading editor
    • Well she may have published her first book in Marlon but if she's really so popular, it could've circulated outside. She seems to have published several books since then.

      I'm sure the "magic experiment" is a reference to Project Ma, and there must have been some survivors, since Lukana is allegedly descending from Leviantans.

      Hard to say what it means about Irina. I've always been under the presumption she never found out who Abyss I.R./Julia's identity was until the letter. But, all the aftermaths are inconsistent in telling parts (Irina's doesn't say what happens to her after the Duel of Merigod but Germaine's say she (Julia) was defeated by Elluka). Since the Lemy the Ripper section says she found out about Irina from the letter she sent, I think we should keep our articles written under that presumption.

      And I have no idea about this coup. It's vague. It could be referring to when Beelzenia took over Retasan, or that the the citizens rebelled against Beelzenia afterward. Our translations of Praeludium do say the people were getting tired of constantly changing political allegiences of the years so it could be foreshadowing. Lily also appears at the end of Praelud so its possible this "coup" would get mentioned (and clarified) there.

        Loading editor
    • Isn't it possible that Elluka knew who Abyss I.R. was but didn't know who Julia was? As in, she knew that Abyss was Irina but, after the incidents on the story of evil, Elluka didn't know what happened to her. Because during the whole Pére Noel thing Irina was in Germaine's body (that and because Elluka and Gumillia may have never got to actually meet Julia personally), Elluka wouldn't know that Julia is Irina. Just that she was some random millionaire who decided to form a criminal association that destroys many people's life for no apparent reason. 

        Loading editor
    • That's possible. She didn't seem to make the connection that I.R. and Abyss I.R. were the same person and I don't think she knew about AB-CIR (unless Platonic blabbed about that). Unless she knew about Abyss I.R. taking Germaine's body while she and Gumillia were involved in the New Four Horsemen Incident, they couldn't be sure.

      Edit: Adding more bits to discuss as well...

      • Based on the aftermath text, sounds like it was Shaw who was criticized because he agreed for Elluka to "feel free to use the wealth and power of the Freesis Foundation" without consent of the other foundation members.
      • Chartette joins Retasan coup (EC 505)
      • Germaine was covered in wounds but stood up due to the support of her "idiot brother"; she "superbly skewered" Abyss I.R. as a result.
      • Gumillia "relied on Elluka's connections" to become the adviser to the Beelzenian Emperor.
      • Gumillia (and I guess this means Elluka too) were at Keel's Marlon home for about "5 months".
      • Kyle hears Prim's monologue at Heartbeat Clocktower in Marlon.
      • Clarith was just helping in EC 500 but was later officially baptized as a nun.
      • Riliane was baptized as a nun with the name "Rin" (according to the aftermath).
        Loading editor
    • 8V Well it makes sense for Shaw to do so given that he knows her personally and all that-- 

      Waitwait. Does this mean that Allen does have the ability to manipulate objects when being sent back to the Heavenly Yard? 8O

      (And surely Elluka's connections date back to her time as a staff officer/supposedly dating and or rejecting the Beelzenian Emperor, but wouldn't they be miffed that she defected from them? And since she's been helping Beelzenia since Venomania's time, is it weird that no one else has discovered her secret of immortality in the Beelzenian Court?)

      Ohh, no mention of when Clarith was baptized officially?

        Loading editor
    • This definitely would change the tone of our translation about Elluka insulting an employee after forcing such a signing. While I can see it happening given her personality, I think Shaw giving it power and receiving criticism from his fellow foundation members makes more sense (and he can do it since he's the firm head).

      I'm pretty sure Allen already could manipulate objects if he could stop Clarith from stabbing Rin. His presence there would be pretty pointless otherwise.

      I bring up the connections because originally it was deemed as "because of Elluka's "pull/connection"," as in "because of Elluka's influence" but given what we have from Praeludium, it doesn't seem like Gumillia was (or could) be influenced by Gumillia to actively go after the Beelzenian Emperor.

      Since she implies she already knew about the summons before Elluka went "missing", this text (for me) seems to state she goes on her own and used Elluka's connections with Beelzenia (and as her apprentice) to get the job.

      Yeah, Clarith's not given an explicit year. Since it isn't mentioned in her aftermath, I guess that means we can safely assume by EC 505 she had definitely become a nun.

      The five months thing with Elluka and Gumillia does bug me. We have a revolution that lasts several weeks and is swiftly thereafter ends with Riliane's execution. If Elluka and Gumillia were at Keel's mansion for months, then Keel had to have fled to a Marlon mansion before the revolution even started.

      Our Wiegenlied translation has Clarith being at the monastery for four months before Elluka and Gumillia saw them and unfortunately we lack a scan of page 220 to confirm that number.

        Loading editor
    • (Adding even more info to mull over from here as well):

      • Elluka had the same position as Gumillia beforehand; friendly terms with the Beelzenian Emperor.
      • Beelzenia reclaiming Retasan (EC 505) was a return from 30 years ago (so either Retasan was conquered in EC 475 or in the years shortly after).
      • Koopa was among the "trade alliance" leaders (中でも商業連合の総帥), along with Keel, who had a great amount of influence; seemingly old ties with the Lucifenian army.
      • Nikolay Tolle still seems to have committed suicide the year before the revolution.
      • The Freesis' hid out in the Abandoned House? (This is for the climax of Praeludium, maybe?).
      • Will Jaques is confirmed to have been acquainted with Elluka at some point, meaning he didn't just learn of her in his research.
      • Langley encampment is in an abanded town after passing through the cemetary; the HQ was the old mayor's home.
      • There are many anecdotes about Banica, one absurd claim that she possessed a "vessel of sin" and used it to manipulate corpses.
      • Vampiress Vanika was the master of the Dead Soldiers using her cursed red glass.

      (Edit: and more)

      • Royal Victory class is a state-of-the-art military warship with the most advanced weapons provided by Marlon, including the recently developed cannon (105 mounted batteries).
      • It is the culmination of Marlon's technology as a maritime nation; doesn't have any ornate decorations.
      • Admiral Dylan (commandeering the ship_ is friends with King Kyle; at the Freesis family's request, he came to pick up Kyle and Yukina with Shaw Freesis as the messenger.
      • Canons are unknown to the land countries (apparently there are low-quality counterfeits outside the Marlon army?).
      • The port town along the former Lucifenian west coast has only received Marlon ships for trade since the blockade with Elphegort.
        Loading editor
    • 8U This all looks like important stuff to add to countries and history sections for characters and groups wouldn't you say? I mean it all comes from the fanbook so there's less need to dispute it unless there's potential translation errors. 

      I'm just wondering if Koopa's going to have an ancestor somewhere down the timeline in one of the untranslated novels. XD Everything mothy puts in a databook is foreshadowing for somewhere else. 

      ...And if Retasan had to be reconquered that recently, Beelzenia's hold is more tenuous than we once thought, right? Makes it seem more likely to me that it gained independence sometime after Story of Evil, like this Coup suggests if it's after Praeludium.

        Loading editor
    • Maybe... I don't know. I feel like we should hold off on the coup thing until Praeludium's done translating. Something about it screams we're missing (or worse: mistranslating) something.

      Otherwise, I think most of this gets a pass. We just have to make sure all the articles are properly supporting it... And next...! There's still a good bit of info from Entr'acte that needs to be mined. Hopefully we can get this transcribed soon:

      • mothy states the Demons of Sin don't have any objective, originally. They just possess humans; however, this does affect them little by little and they can eventually develop their own goals.
      • Behemo sect is in fact the smallest Levin denomination (at least during Story of Evil); it only exists in some small parts of Asmodean.
      • This is the interview that confirms that all the vessels of sin are ordinary objects, save for one exception where it was originally a magic tool.
      • According to mothy, Ney, Clarith, and Chartette were there from the very beginning of his story for the songs, just different roles and set up; in the first set up, Ney was the older stepsister (welp... seems that didn't change much...).
      • The existence of the Demons and vessels isn't widely known to the public; it exists in fairy tales but no one believes; however, some royals, nobles, and church groups know of their existence (guess that foreshadows Veno, Conchi, Beelzenia's royalty, and Neo Apocalypse).
      • Explanation on the relationship between the Demon's "vessel" and "body" and why you can't just destroy the vessels.
        Loading editor
    • I checked Praefacio. Yarera and Zusco are the pirates Germaine recognizes (page 33). With all there small appearances here and there, I support them getting pages once they get good face shots. XD

        Loading editor
    • Completly unrelated but I just borrowed a book on mythology and I noticed something that I relate to Gumillia

        Loading editor
    • Would it be like Waiter length pages for them with all their information combined...? I'm a bit hesitant to have more pages like those. >.>;;

      Oh that explanation between the Demon's vessel and body seems highly relevant. Is there more clarification on that point?

        Loading editor
    • Each would be a little over twice the length in the History section at least, all things considered.

      I can't say more about the questions without a full transcription to work with; it would be me speculating.

        Loading editor
    • Got something neat. Koopa's mansion is prefaced with "Lucifenian" (the capitol). Besides adding that to its location, I think that can confirm a few things:

      A) Keel was put under house arrest in the capital so Germaine and York didn't have to travel far to meet with him.

      B) Keel must have gone to Marlon before the revolution (somehow avoiding house arrest), hence why Elluka and Gumillia were there for months while the revolution seems to have only lasted a few weeks.

      C) Kyle didn't travel far to meet with Koopa (the distance between the palace and Lucifenian doesn't seem to be too far); therefore, neither did Yukina.

      Are Wiegenlied translation says Clarith was at the monastery for about four months; the fanbook says Elluka and Gumillia were at the Freesis mansion in Marlon for about five. I'm going to assume Clarith's estimate is the one that's a bit off (though they're close, timeline-wise).

        Loading editor
    • Now that we have the first page of the interview transcribed:

      • The Demons of Sin originally have no purpose, they're just existences that spread disaster but, by possessing humans, a subtle effect is had on the spirit of the demons themselves, causing a change, so the possibility of the demons beginning to have a purpose from it can't be denied (rough paraphrase of the answer).
      • The Behemo sect exists as a minority. It's a sect that only exists in small parts of Asmodean. The tinge/hue/tint of demon beliefs is strong so it's almost not publicly recognizes in the country. (rough paraphrase for the answer).
      • This is definitely the Q&A interview that talks about the vessels all being ordinary items without their Demons, save for one (an exception).
        Loading editor
    • Yay even more!

      • mothy was asked if we'd see more of the "[color] country" schtick with Levianta, Asmodean, etc. because of their people's race or color.
      • mothy clarified that only Elphegort has a name for its people's hair color; the reason for Lucifenia being dubbed the "Yellow Country" was because its founder, King Lucifenia I, commanded a yellow (golden?)-armored army (it's a "strong theory").
      • When asked about what entertainment people of this time enjoyed, mothy said that literature and poetry was favored by the high-class (something about commoners like Chartette but sentence is too hazy for me);
      • Entertainment enjoyed by both the rich and poor is opera.
      • Protection of literature is particularly active in Elphegort, it was a good window of opportunity (subsidaries) for those talented. Even Keel when giving Michaela her singing was apparently given subsidies (something about that perhaps being "mercenary" XD).
      • Apparently the story is said that the Magic Kingdom Levianta once divide small classes/ranks by their abilities (this was into response if there would any other "royal court mage" distinctions like Elluka, even though there were few mages left).
      • Asked his favorite character. He brings up the Three Heroes, especially Mariam.
        Loading editor
    • 悪ノ召使 - Servant of Evil PV - opera ver

      悪ノ召使 - Servant of Evil PV - opera ver. 【鏡音レン】

      DID SOMEONE SAY OPERA
        Loading editor
    • Finally was have that line of reasoning! Although wow, I guess Lucifenia I was pretty wealthy/advantaged at that point to specifically make all his soldiers shiny and gold colored. ouo 

      I feel like the line about Chartette probably deals with how she or others of her station enjoy literature themselves but it might be difficult for them to obtain them...? such as her sneaking out to get books. (Depending on what the preceding line is, could it be like "there are exceptions to that like commoners such as Chartette." Opera is a new thing; I don't think we've seen that in the stories proper, have we? 

      I feel like you might have to clarify the subsidiaries thing for me though. @~@;

      Hmm, makes sense. Judging by their previous ruler being a prophet and Adam being considered fit to succeed her (compared to the Ma) I feel like Levianta's legitimacy to rule was based on who had the most magical power, so even if they had inherited wealth like Ly Li's family there was more social mobility. Do you think that would be related to Kiril earning the title/surname Clockworker? (Doesthisreplymakesense-)

        Loading editor
    • Yeah, I'm curious how he gets yellow-armored soldiers unless he invented spray paint. XD

      Opera may or may not pop up with Lolan Eve in the Lunacy novel but it's hard to tell, since she was just a dancer working at the theater. It could be just a regular stage theater or they may perform opera.

      Subsidaries? Whoops, typo. I meant subsidies. Basically, the Elphegort government would give money to those promoting literature (and the arts in general, if Keel was getting paid for Michaela's singing). Seems Keel's good will always comes back to profit. XD

      I get the titles thing. I'm not sure about social mobility though, as you do need to have great magical power in the first place. It does make sense though, as after this interview, we have Act 1 and Act 2 showing a few other ranks